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The King of Kong: A Fistful of Quarters


Svar
Zzap!Zzap!Skrevet 21/10-07 22:48 
Jeg har lige set dokumentaren The King of Kong, om Steve Wiebe og Billy Mitchells rekordforsøg i Donkey Kong.
Her er Wikipedia siden om den: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_king_of_kong
En af de bedste dokumentarer i denne stil jeg nogensinde har set, helt... Se hele indlægget
Born to kill space
78 emne(r).
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Svar
millenniummillenniumSkrevet 05/02-18 10:19 
Dokumentarfilm skal også bruge nogle plotstyrede elementer for at beskrive temaet (ikke den reelle historie).
King of Kong handler jo om at tabe konkurrencen men vinde publikums hjerte - noget som almene personer kan relatere til, men det afspejler ikke nødvendigvis den virkelige virkelighed. :-) Reelt kunne de måske have byttet roller, men Mitchell er bare bedre i skurke-rollen.
The medium is the message.
SumezSumezSkrevet 05/02-18 10:36 
slk486>
Jeg ved ikke hvorfor du bringer King of Kong ind i det?

Er det ikke det tråden handler om?

slk486>
Jeg siger bare at der næsten må være noget spite involveret til at bruge så meget krudt på det.

Og jeg tror nærmere det er omvendt. King of Kong og Billy Mitchell har været med til at inspirere rigtig mange mennesker til at gå efter høje scores i Donkey Kong, og de fleste har så meget respekt for manden at de vil forsvare ham uanset hvor mange beviser der opstår imod ham. Hans scores har altid været de dårligst dokumenterede på DonkeyKongForum, og nye scores ville aldrig blive accepteret med optagelser af tilsvarende kvalitet. Den var kun på listen i første omgang fordi det var Billy Mitchell - han har ikke ikke engang submittet den selv, og har ikke nogen bruger på forummet så vidt jeg ved.

Hans optagelser har altid været tvivlsomme, og jeg tror endda også det er et emne i filmen. Der har været disputes på Twin Galaxies omkring scoren siden den blev postet. Når der har været folk der har været stærke modstandere af scoren i lang tid er det netop pga. den særbehandling Billy Mitchell har fået. Hvis du læser Xelnia's indlæg er han faktisk beklagende overfor at han er nødt til at fjerne scoren, men gør det da troværdigheden i deres highscore-liste er alfa og omega for dem.

Personligt synes jeg det er lidt noget pjat, og foretrækker communities hvor venlig konkurrence og indforstået tillid er i højsædet, men det er ikke sådan "classic arcade" folkene opererer. :P
Spis sundt og tro på dig selvSpiller nu: Toki, Tetris Effect, Shadow Tower: Abyss
SumezSumezSkrevet 05/02-18 10:37 
Reelt kunne de måske have byttet roller, men Mitchell er bare bedre i skurke-rollen.

Reelt set burde Tim Sczerby jo nok have været med, men Mitchell er bare bedre i en rolle i det hele taget :P
Spis sundt og tro på dig selvSpiller nu: Toki, Tetris Effect, Shadow Tower: Abyss
slk486slk486Skrevet 05/02-18 13:22, rettet 05/02-18 13:24 
Sumez>
slk486>
Jeg ved ikke hvorfor du bringer King of Kong ind i det?

Er det ikke det tråden handler om?

Ha ha, jo sorry :D Jeg kommenterede på det uden kontekst af resten af tråden.

Jeg tror såmend du generelt har ret, men når man bruger så meget krudt på at modbevise en anden, så må det jo være fordi man har lidt ondt bag i. Reelt eller ej, så ville man vel ikke gøre det, hvis tilliden var der og man godt kunne lide Mitchell.
j/k
SumezSumezSkrevet 05/02-18 13:28, rettet 05/02-18 13:29 
Faktum er at Billy Mitchell er decideret utroværdig, og der aldrig er nogen der har haft tillid til ham. :P

Grunden til at jeg bringer King of Kong op i denne sammenhæng er at man dog heller ikke skal dømme ham ud fra den film. Jeg har aldrig kunnet holde ud at se filmen færdig på grund af den latterligt farvede måde den portrætterer personerne. Jeg ved ikke rigtig noget om Billy Mitchell når det kommer til stykket, men ud fra virkelighedens verden har jeg aldrig fået andre indtryk at han (til trods for ovenstående) er en enormt åben og skideflink person, og alle der har mødt ham bakker op om det indtryk.
Spis sundt og tro på dig selvSpiller nu: Toki, Tetris Effect, Shadow Tower: Abyss
slk486slk486Skrevet 05/02-18 13:31 
Det er også det indtryk jeg selv har af ham, men han fungerer skidegodt som skurk i King of Kong :)
j/k
millenniummillenniumSkrevet 05/02-18 14:02 
Det er jo en konstrueret kontrast som gør, at King of Kong også er almen interessant for seere, som ikke nødvendigvis interesserer sig for spil. :) Den slags anvendes i de fleste former for dokumentarer. Man kunne sikkert proppe Donkey Kong, Wiebe, Mitchell, Twin Galaxies og filmens andre elementer ind i den klassiske aktantmodel, hvori journalister typisk konstruerer deres formidling.

Det kræver blot en masse sund fornuft og mediekundskab som seer ikke at æde det råt.
The medium is the message.
BeanoBeanoSkrevet 05/02-18 14:07, rettet 05/02-18 14:10 
slk486>
Jeg tror såmend du generelt har ret, men når man bruger så meget krudt på at modbevise en anden, så må det jo være fordi man har lidt ondt bag i. Reelt eller ej, så ville man vel ikke gøre det, hvis tilliden var der og man godt kunne lide Mitchell.

Måske derfor der er gået over 10 år før snyderiet blev opdaget? ;)
slk486slk486Skrevet 05/02-18 17:48 
Ikke forstået? :)
j/k
BeanoBeanoSkrevet 05/02-18 20:15 
Dårlig formulering. Jeg mente det generelt, at der må have været så enorm tillid og respekt for manden at der ikke er blevet kigget grundigt på optagelsen før nu :D
slk486slk486Skrevet 06/02-18 09:30 
Tjah, man havde vel ikke grund til ikke at tro på det før nogen synes man skulle så tvivl omkring det :)
j/k
BeanoBeanoSkrevet 12/04-18 15:50 
Så kom TG's afgørelse efter længere tids undersøgelser.

Av...

The King of Kong: A Fistful of Quarters
slk486slk486Skrevet 12/04-18 16:59 
No worries, han har jo VHS bånd der beviser endnu højere scores i baghånden ;)
j/k
BeanoBeanoSkrevet 12/04-18 17:15, rettet 12/04-18 17:15 
Billy kommer nok til at skulle koncentrere sig om hans hot-sauce forretning fremover ;)
BeanoBeanoSkrevet 12/04-18 20:25 
TG’s begrundelse...

Based on the complete body of evidence presented in this official dispute thread, Twin Galaxies administrative staff has unanimously decided to remove all of Billy Mitchell’s’ scores as well as ban him from participating in our competitive leaderboards.

We have notified Guinness World Records of our decision.

On 08-28-2017 Twin Galaxies member Jeremey Young ( @xelnia ) filed a dispute claim assertion against the validity of Billy Mitchell’s historical and current original arcade Donkey Kong score performances of 1,047,200 (the King of Kong "tape"), 1,050,200 (the Mortgage Brokers score), and 1,062,800 (the Boomers score) on the technical basis of a demonstrated impossibility of original unmodified Donkey Kong arcade hardware to produce specific board transition images shown in the videotaped recordings of those adjudicated performances.

Jeremy’s assertion concluded that not only can original Donkey Kong arcade hardware not produce the board transition images shown in the recordings, but that these transitions were actually generated through the use of MAME (emulation software.)

The rules for submitting scores for the original arcade Donkey Kong competitive leaderboards requires the use of original arcade hardware only. The use of MAME or any other emulation software for submission to these leaderboards is strictly forbidden.

Jeremy Young provided his dispute case evidence to the dispute thread for both public and Twin Galaxies scrutiny and review.

Twin Galaxies has meticulously tested and investigated the dispute case assertions as well as a number of relevant contingent factors, such as the veracity of the actual video performances that the dispute claim assertions rely upon.

In addition to Twin Galaxies’ own investigation into the dispute case assertions, at least two different 3rd parties conducted their own explorations and came to identical conclusions.

Most notable was the 3rd party (Carlos Pinerio) that Billy Mitchell engaged to help examine the dispute case claims on his behalf, utilizing whatever original equipment Billy could provide, whose final finding was consistent with Twin Galaxies investigation and others.

Additionally, during the evidence gathering period of this dispute, numerous experts, hobbyists, and casual observers participated and contributed to this investigation.

Here are our specific findings:

- The taped Donkey Kong score performances of 1,047,200 (the King of Kong "tape"), 1,050,200 (the Mortgage Brokers score) that were historically used by Twin Galaxies to substantiate those scores and place them in the database were not produced by the direct feed output of an original unmodified Donkey Kong Arcade PCB.

- The 1,062,800 (the Boomers score) Donkey Kong performance does not have enough of a body of direct evidence for Twin Galaxies to feel comfortable to make a definitive determination on at this time.

- The 1047 and 1050 score performance videos we have in our possession (and are basing our determinations on) are in fact the performances that were used by previous Twin Galaxies administration as justification for those scores to be entered into the database and for Twin Galaxies to attribute those specific accomplishments to Billy Mitchell. We have several different and unique sources of these performances and access to private historical Twin Galaxies referee e-mail distribution records showing where these sources acquired their copies and what the purpose was.

- Of significant note is that it is very straightforward for anyone to check the authenticity of the 1047 performance source tape by just cross-referencing the digital capture video of the performance that has been posted in this dispute thread with the very public “King of Kong” movie gameplay footage along with its DVD extras.

- While we know for certain that an unmodified original DK arcade PCB did not output the display seen in the videotaped score performances, we cannot definitively conclude that what is on the tapes is MAME.

- To definitively conclude that MAME was used, Twin Galaxies would need to comprehensively rule out the possibility of all other methods that could produce what is seen on the tapes. This would mean testing all other emulators other than MAME across all other platforms to eliminate the possibility that a different emu was used. It would also mean testing visual effects software and anything else we can think of to be definitively certain. This kind of testing is beyond the scope of the dispute case needs.

From a Twin Galaxies viewpoint, the only important thing to know is whether or not the score performances are from an unmodified original DK arcade PCB as per the competitive rules. We now believe that they are not from an original unmodified DK arcade PCB, and so our investigation of the tape content ends with that conclusion and assertion.

Twin Galaxies has endeavored to provide a fair opportunity and reasonable amount of time for all sides and interests to present their thoughts and evidence as it has evaluated this dispute claim.

Twin Galaxies has also investigated this matter as comprehensively as reasonably possible to make sure that its findings are as informed as possible.

Throughout every step of this investigation, Billy Mitchell had the opportunity to answer questions and contribute to the public dispute thread. However, he was under no obligation to participate in this dispute thread and as such he chose not to do so.

Twin Galaxies is only looking at the dispute claim assertions about score performances and either validating or refuting those claims specifically - it is not evaluating people.

Twin Galaxies would like to give a huge thank you to all involved in this dispute from all sides. Our community, the DKF community, @xelnia and @YesAffinity specifically and many many others have contributed tremendously and deserve proper and full recognition.

Hopefully it is becoming more and more obvious that we care very much about our scoreboard integrity and will continue to improve it step-by-step, no matter how painful or public it might occasionally be.

This has been said before, but it is important to repeat that Twin Galaxies is dedicated to absolutely rooting out invalid scores from our historic database wherever we find them.

Twin Galaxies’ recent efforts to build a dispute system for the purpose of allowing scores to be questioned in a centralized and documented manner have enabled all of the available evidence regarding Billy Mitchell’s score performances to finally, after many years, be concentrated, examined and discussed by non-anonymous members of the gaming community and Twin Galaxies administration. This system has created a permanent body of evidence for examination.

Anyone looking into their own past with honesty and a desire to improve will likely find things potentially messy and uncomfortable. Twin Galaxies has experienced a nice big dose of that again with this dispute. However, Twin Galaxies understands that this is required for it to continue its commitment to accuracy. As we all have learned, this cannot occur overnight and must be a step-by-step process.

Just as in other disputes, we definitely know that many in the gaming community operate with a general urgency and would have preferred to see this matter resolved more swiftly.

However, Twin Galaxies, as part of a comprehensive process and in its position of authority, must ensure due diligence. Our public documentation of our processes and conclusions are intended to satisfy scrutiny for the long term, so in instances where warranted our comprehensiveness must go above and beyond what would normally satisfy.

Our methodic approach has allowed many things to surface, not only related to this specific score, but other scores as well as some previously never-before-discussed video game related history.

We must repeat, the truth is the priority. That is the concern. Whatever it takes.

Twin Galaxies continues to strive to earn and maintain trust over time by making supportable decisions and taking sensible actions.

With this ruling Twin Galaxies can no longer recognize Billy Mitchell as the 1st million point Donkey Kong record holder. According to our findings, Steve Wiebe would be the official 1st million point record holder.

Thanks again to all who contributed time, effort and expertise to this case.
spectrespectreSkrevet 13/04-18 07:47 
Ligesom Todd Rodgers så er han blevet banned for at deltage på Twin Galaxies fremover. Når man er blevet taget i snyd, så er det ikke til at vide hvad han ellers har snydt i, så alle Billy's scores blevet fjernet fra Twin Galaxies.

Twin Galaxies har sendt deres beslutning til Guinness, så de skal nok også til at tage stilling til hvad de har givet af awards til manden.

Billy blev også de-credited som den første der fik over 1 million i Donkey Kong.
Keep it simpleSpiller nu: Fallout 4
millenniummillenniumSkrevet 13/04-18 09:37 
Under alle omstændigheder så er det en så god historie at det sagtens kunne filmatiseres. Igen.
The medium is the message.
BeanoBeanoSkrevet 13/04-18 10:51 
Der florerer rygter om en KoK2, men nok et ændret plot nu :D
BeanoBeanoSkrevet 14/04-18 23:32 
Guinness World Records fjerner også BM’s scores.

https://kotaku.com/after-donkey-kong-controv...es-all-of-1825240701
BeanoBeanoSkrevet 15/04-18 22:26 
BM’s respons...

https://youtu.be/mjtn3EEG65Q
BeanoBeanoSkrevet 25/06-18 08:55 
BM's 1 time snak om affæren på Southern-Fried Gaming Expo.

Dejligt at hans ego er intakt :D

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RGrAnBM30-U
la0sla0sSkrevet 25/06-18 10:14 
Det er fucking wrestling persona det der.
Hvad sker der?
KTCKTCSkrevet 25/06-18 12:43 
Hvordan kan man ævle en time, uden at man siger noget som helst, der giver mening? Manden må have en hjerneskade...
Var det eneste argument ikke, at det er fordi kameraet optog i 30fps, så mente han at spillet kom til at ligne MAME emulering?
A small cog? Now that you mention it, I know a puzzle about an object that almost fits that description.
millenniummillenniumSkrevet 25/06-18 12:46 
You either die villain, or see yourself become a moron.
The medium is the message.
BeanoBeanoSkrevet 30/07-18 20:15 
BM scorer præcist 1.000.000, og går fra maskinen :D

https://youtu.be/3JXrUzZT67Y
BeanoBeanoSkrevet 18/06 18:23, rettet 18/06 18:25 
Historien fortsætter...

Billy Mitchell får sine Guinness rekorder tilbage.

https://youtu.be/K2x6ZrWUkWo

https://www.guinnessworldrecords.com/news/20...illy-mitchell-621053
slk486slk486Skrevet 18/06 20:29 
Det er godt nok noget af en saga! :D
j/k
BeanoBeanoSkrevet 19/06 09:18 
"Billy Mitchell har altid en plan."

- Billy Mitchell
78 emne(r).
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